From telecom-request@delta.eecs.nwu.edu Thu Sep 7 18:57:41 1995 by 1995 18:57:41 -0400 telecomlist-outbound; Thu, 7 Sep 1995 15:19:47 -0500 1995 15:19:44 -0500 To: telecom@eecs.nwu.edu TELECOM Digest Thu, 7 Sep 95 15:19:00 CDT Volume 15 : Issue 373 Inside This Issue: Editor: Patrick A. Townson India Recieves $82 Billion in Telecom Service Bids (Rishab Aiyer Ghosh) Re: T1 Direct to Modem Bank (Les Reeves) Re: Area Code Crisis -- A Different Viewpoint (Steve Cogorno) Re: Boston Area Telephone Exchange Name History (Scott D. Fybush) Re: E-Mail -> Pager Gateway? (Doug Reuben) Selling Off Municipal Phone System (Peter S. Goodman) TELECOM Digest is an electronic journal devoted mostly but not exclusively to telecommunications topics. It is circulated anywhere there is email, in addition to various telecom forums on a variety of public service systems and networks including Compuserve and America On Line. It is also gatewayed to Usenet where it appears as the moderated newsgroup 'comp.dcom.telecom'. Subscriptions are available to qualified organizations and individual readers. Write and tell us how you qualify: * telecom-request@eecs.nwu.edu * The Digest is edited, published and compilation-copyrighted by Patrick Townson of Skokie, Illinois USA. You can reach us by postal mail, fax or phone at: 9457-D Niles Center Road Skokie, IL USA 60076 Phone: 500-677-1616 Fax: 708-329-0572 ** Article submission address only: telecom@eecs.nwu.edu ** Our archives are located at lcs.mit.edu and are available by using anonymous ftp. The archives can also be accessed using our email information service. 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A suggested donation of twenty dollars per year per reader is considered appropriate. See our address above. All opinions expressed herein are deemed to be those of the author. Any organizations listed are for identification purposes only and messages should not be considered any official expression by the organization. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ==This Indian Techonomist bulletin (C) Copyright 1995 Rishab Aiyer Ghosh India receives $82 BILLION in bids for telecom services August 31, 1995: Bids for basic telecom services across India were opened today. Sixteen companies submitted the 80 bids for 20 regions (or "circles"); they were worth a total of $82 BILLION in licence fees alone. The total bids for likely winners - one private provider is to compete with the government Department of Telecommunications (DoT) in each circle - were worth $35.6 billion spread over the next decade. The surprise star of the show was HFCL, a company with political connections and a joint venture with Israel's Bezeq, led in all nine circles for which it bid a total of over $27 billion, between two and five times the value of the nearest bids in the nine circles. HFCL bid for the most lucrative areas; Reliance, a large group with diverse interests and nearly 3 million shareholders, bid very low for all circles, and got most of the weakest circles, classified "C" by the government. However, in the desert state of Rajasthan, where competing Shyam (with China's PTT Guangdong) bid $350 million, 80 times higher than Reliance, the latter may yet win as Shyam is rumoured to be disqualified on technical grounds. That makes 15 circles out of 20 divided between two companies. Denro Ispat, a steel firm in cooperation with America's Hughes, bagged the wealthy western states of Karnataka and Maharashtra (which includes Bombay). BPL, a consumer electronics company, won the southern state of Tamil Nadu in cooperation with US West. This will end the controversy over US West's pilot project in semi-rural Tamil Nadu involving broadband and wireless services, which was negotiated directly, bypassing the bidding process. Big losers included AT&T, who bid along with Birla Communications; Bell Atlantic who bid with Essar; Bell Canada who bid with the Tatas, another conglomerate; and Japan's NTT which bid with Itochu and India's RPG group. The Indian Techonomist spoke to Dr N Ravi, General Manager of Reliance's Telecommunications Group. He was pessimistic about any speedy resolution of the bids. Licences have to be awarded after a weighted evaluation of the other portion of the bids, including a development plan and rural infrastructure. However, the skewed bidding and relative lack of competition will cause problems, as it did with bids for cellular services, opened three weeks ago. There may be "caps" - limits on the number of licences for a single company, two in the case of cellular services. There may be backdoor deals. There may well be a re-arrangement of Indian and foreign partners, perhaps forming new "friendships" between till-now competing companies. Caps would be good for AT&T; they would also be good for HFCL. For if it did not seriously misjudge the value of the market, HFCL probably hoped that the government's caps would, in effect, give it a free post-bid choice. At this point it seem that although contracts for cellular services may be awarded soon - though not by the government target of September 15th - those for basic services will be considerably delayed. Apart from the complications caused by the bidding itself, there's a court order against awarding contracts, which will probably be appealed. And there's the Parliament, which doesn't want to pass a stop-gap amendment allowing the government to set up a regulator until more permanent legislation is ready - Opposition parties claim they want to make the regulator a statutory body right away, although in fact they just enjoy troubling the government. Besides, the government has the imminent general elections - due in the middle of next year - on its mind. And the assasination, a few hours after the bids were opened, of the Chief Minister of the wealthy state (and - it was expected - profitable telecom market) of Punjab. Telecom services will be privatised, after a gap. A most interesting gap - the fun has just begun. The complete list of bids for basic services will be available in a few hours at http://dxm.org/techonomist/news/bids.html See also: Telecom regulation - http://dxm.org/techonomist/regu.html and Cellular services - http://dxm.org/techonomist/news/cellular.html -==(C) Copyright 1995 Rishab Aiyer Ghosh. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. -==Licensed for ELECTRONIC distribution, including commercial, provided -==this notice is attached. This bulletin is from The Indian Techonomist, -==the newsletter on India's information industry. -==http://dxm.org/techonomist/ - e-mail rishab@arbornet.org -==Phone +91 11 6853410; H-34-C Saket, New Delhi 110017, INDIA. The Indian Techonomist - newsletter on India's information industry http://dxm.org/techonomist/ rishab@dxm.org Editor and publisher: Rishab Aiyer Ghosh rishab@arbornet.org Vox +91 11 6853410; 3760335; H 34 C Saket, New Delhi 110017, INDIA ------------------------------ Gary Secor (glsecor@ix.netcom.com) wrote: > I have some switched 800 lines now dumping on a centrex hunt group (16 > lines). I want to look at a T1 that replaces these switched lines > since it should result in lower cost per minute and some better > disaster recovery redirection options. What can I connect the T1 to > that will allow it to connect to 16 modems? I suspect there may be a > card that goes in a pc that can look like 23 or 24 analog lines. What > is it called and what might it cost? Who has such an animal? Any other > suggestions appreciated. I can use existing modem rack or am willing to > look at a new one if it fits the situation. All thoughts appreciated! If you want to use your existing modems, you will need a channel bank with 16 2WFXS (two-wire FX station) cards. Telco Systems makes excellent channel banks. However, I am somewhat biased since I sold them for three years . Les lreeves@crl.com Atlanta,GA 404.874.7806 ------------------------------ Sergio Gelato said: > Here in Italy, where variable-length numbers are the norm, the system As I understand it, they won't be the norm much longer. As the network converts to digital, aren't the numbers becoming standardized lengths? > is constructed so that it is always possible in principle to determine > from the digits dialled so far whether the number is complete or not. > That is, 2345 67 and 2345 678 cannot both be valid numbers, but you > can have 2345 67 and 2345 680, 2345 681, etc. In theory, this means > that timeouts are never absolutely necessary. Of course for long The main problem with variable length phone numbers is NOT technical as you have pointed out; it is difficult for humans to use. It is very confusing to not know how many digits to expect. Suppose you have a form that someone has filled out and there are only six digits. Does this mean that the number is incomplete, or is it actually correct? > I suspect that the cost of reprogramming all that data entry software > that expects NXX-NXX-XXXX for phone numbers is the real reason the USA > are trying to stick to 3+7 for as long as possible. As you note, there > is no intrinsic reason from the point of view of the network itself. Well there is in that the USERS of the network expect the numbers to be in the NPA-NXX-XXXX format. Additionally, why is there are need for variable length numbers? With the new NPS system, there are at least 2.7 BILLION numbers available. > (Related question: why are the USA still using only nine digits for > Social Security Numbers, despite all the obvious shortcomings?) There are one billion possible numbers of SSN. I believe the numbers are reused after a file has been closed for a number of years. For what it's worth, the first three digits of an SSN determine where the card was issued (sort of like an area code). Steve cogorno@netcom.com ------------------------------ Interesting to note how, with just a few exceptions, all of these exchanges have survived for 35-plus years now, intact: > DOWNTOWN - 185 Franklin St. Office ** > CApitol 3 State Capitol Building Federal Govt. offices only > CApitol 7 State Capitol Building CAPitol > LAfayette 3 Revolutionary War Hero LAFayette > MEridian 7 Time-of-day information MEridian 7-1234 (only) > RIchmond 2 Richmond Street RIChmond > SHerwin 3 Telephone Pioneer N.E. Telephone Co. offices only > WEather 6 Weather information WEather 6-1234 (only) 223, 227, 523 and 742 are all still around, all served out of Franklin Street. 637-1234 and 936-1234 still get the time and weather. And NYNEX offices are still the sole users of 743. > DOWNTOWN - 8 Harrison Ave. Office ** > DEvonshire 8 Devonshire Street Only Boston Police (DE 8- 1212) > and pay phones had this prefix > HAncock 1 Revolutionary War Hero Only for John Hancock Ins. Co. > HAncock 6 Revolutionary War Hero HANcock > HUbbard 2 Telephone Pioneer HUBbard > LIberty 2 Patriotic word LIBerty 421, 426, 482, and 542 are all still around. So is 338, which is now in general use. > DOWNTOWN - BACK BAY ** > CIrcle 7 Name origin unknown Only pay phones on this exchange > COngress 2 Not a local name Created in 1950s > COmmonwealth 6 Commonwealth Ave. COMmonwealth > COpley 7 Copley Square COPley > KEnmore 6 Kenmore Square KENmore 262, 266, 267, and 536 are all still around. So is 247, which served the Boston Police PBX until just about two years ago, when they moved to 617-343. 247 is now in general use. > ARLINGTON > MIssion 3 / 8 Not a local name Replaced manual office in 1950s > HUnter 3 / 8 Not a local name {Served customers of ARlington manual > {exchange located in W. Medford. 643 and 648 are still around. So are 483 and 488, now known as the "West Medford" exchange (but still billed identically to Arlington). > BELMONT > IVanhoe 4 / 9 Not a local name Replaced manual office in 1950s. 484 and 489 are not only still around, but are STILL the only exchanges in Belmont. > BRIGHTON / ALLSTON > ALgonquin 4 Name origin unknown ALGonquin > STadium 2 Harvard Stadium STAdium 254 and 782 still exist...in fact I have a couple of 254 lines on my office telephone. > BROOKLINE > BEacon 2 Beacon Street BEAcon > ASpinwall 7 Aspinwall Avenue ASPinwall > LOngwood 6 Longwood Avenue LONgwood > REgent 4 Not a local name Created in 1950s 232, 277, 566, and 734 are all still around. > CAMBRIDGE > ELiot 4 Eliot Street ELIot > KIrkland 7 Kirkland Street KIRkland > Trowbridge 6 Trowbridge Street TROwbridge > UNiversity 4 Harvard University UNIversity > UNiversity 8 Harvard University UNIversity 354, 547, 876, 864, and 868 are all still there, accompanied nowadays by a slew of 49X exchanges, most belonging to Harvard, and several MIT exchanges as well. > CHARLESTOWN > CHarlestown 2 Name of area served CHArlestown 242's still there, and it spawned 241 a few years later. > CHELSEA > TUrner 4 / 9 Not a local name Replaced CHelsea 3 manual office 1957 Still there as 884 and 889. There's now an 887 as well, created after the old 617-887 Boxford became 508-887 in 1988. > DORCHESTER > BAyside 9 Dorchester Bay Created in 1950s > COlumbia 5 Columbia Road COLumbia > AVenue 2 / 8 Dorchester Avenue? Created in 1948 > GEneva 6 Geneva Avenue GENeva > TAlbot 5 Talbot Avenue TALbot Here's one that's gone. 229 is now a Burlington exchange, but a fairly recent one. Perhaps BAyside 9 became 929? 265, 282, 288, 436, and 825 are still around. > EAST BOSTON > Logan 7 / 9 Logan Airport {Replaced EAstboston 7 manual office > {approx 1957 567 and 569 - still there. There's 561 and 568 now as well, the latter added after 617-568 Hudson became 508-568 in 1988. > HYDE PARK > --------- > EMpire 1 / 4 Not a local name {Replaced HYdepark 3 manual office > {approx 1955 > EDgewater 3 Not a local name [Served customers formerly in > [HYdepark 3 located in Milton 361 and 364 are still there (the mayor's home phone is on 364). 333 is around as well, but now counted as a Milton exchange with 696/698 - see below under Mattapan/Milton. > JAMAICA PLAIN > JAmaica 2 / 4 Name of community JAMaica 522 and 524 - still around. > LEXINGTON ·_ > VOlunteer 1/3 Patriotic name Replaced manual office in 1950s > (Minute Man) 861 and 863 are still in Lexington, now with 860 and 862 as well. > MALDEN > DAvenport 2 /4 Not a local name Replaced manual office in 1950s. 322, 324...still in use, along with 321. > MEDFORD > EXport 5 / 6 Not a local name Replaced manual office in 1950s. As 395 and 396, these remain in use today. > MILTON / MATTAPAN > BLuehills 8 Blue Hills Reservation Split in 1959 > CUnningham 6 Cunningham Park Split in 1959 > CYpress 6 Not a local name Mattapan customers prev. on CU6 > CYpress 8 Not a local name Mattapan customers prev. on BL8 > OXford 6 Not a local name Milton customers prev. on CU6 > OXford 8 Not a local name Milton cistomers prev. on BL8 The BL8 and CU6 exchanges both returned much later -- 258 as an MIT exchange in Cambridge, 286 in Revere. 296/298 still serves Mattapan, 696/698 still serves Milton. > NEEDHAM > HIllcrest 4 Not a local name Replaced NEedham 3 manual office 444. Still in use, along with 449, 455, and 433 added later. > NEWTON > BIgelow 4 Name origin unknown BIGelow > DEcatur 2 Name origin unknown DECatur > LAsalle 7 LaSalle Junior College LASalle > WOodward 9 Not a local name Created in 1950s 244, 332, 527, and 969 all still exist...along with about a dozen more recent additions. > QUINCY > GRanite 2 / 9 Local granite quarry GRAnite > MAyflower 9 Pilgrims' ship MAYflower > PResident 3 Quincy is birthplace of Presidents John Adams & J.Q.Adams MA9 - or 629 - no longer exists. 472, 479, and 773 are all still there, with several more recent editions. The 629 exchange was assigned much later to Somerville. Besides GR9/479, there are no other XX9 exchanges in Quincy even now. > REVERE > ATlantic 4 /9 Revere located on ocean {Replaced REvere 8 manual office > {approx 1957 284 and 289 are still around, along with 286 (see Milton/Mattapan, above). > ROXBURY > GArrison 7 William Lloyd Garrison GARrison > (Abolitionist) > HIghlands 2 /5 Roxbury Highlands HIGhlands 427, 442, 445 - all still there. Very little phone growth there - the only new addition in 35 years was 541 a few years back. > SOMERVILLE > MOnument 6 Name origin unknown Replaced manual office in 1950's > PRospect 6 Name origin unknown Replaced manual office in 1950's 666 and 776 remain in existence, along with several newer exchanges. > SOUTH BOSTON > ANdrew 8 / 9 Andrew Square {Replaced SOuthboston 8 manual > {office in early 1950's 268 and 269 are still around, along with newer 463 and 464 exchanges. > WALTHAM > TWinbrook 3 /9 Not a local name Replaced manual office in 1950's Waltham has seen explosive phone growth, fueled by DID-heavy users in office parks along Route 128. 893 and 899 are still around, with 890, 891, and 894 arriving a few years later, and literally dozens of new exchanges in the last decade. Many of the new "Waltham" exchanges are used by Cellular One, which used to have its local headquarters in Waltham. > WATERTOWN > WAlker 4 / 6 Not a local name {Replaced WAtertown 3 manual office > {in 1950's > Note: WAlker was used as the new prefix even though Watertown began with WA Hmm ... I'd always just assumed it was WAtertown! 924 and 926 are still there, plus 923 and 972, the last for town government only. > WEST ROXBURY > FAirview 3/5/7 Not a local name Replaced manual office approx 1954 > HOmestead 9 Not a local name {Used for Brookline customers served > (by W. Roxbury central office 323, 325, 327 -- and that's still it. 469 is still in existence too, but now counted as a "Brookline" exchange. I believe there's still a geographic area along the Brookline/W.Roxbury/Newton line where ALL customers are assigned 469 and only 469. > WINTHROP > VIking 6 Not a local name Replaced manual office in 1950s 846 - still around and only recently joined by 539. Great list! -- and fun to see how far back many of today's exchanges go. -=Scott Fybush - fybush@world.std.com - Waltham MA=- ------------------------------ Recently, Eric De Mund wrote: > Is there an email -> pager gateway? I'd like to be able to have clients > send email to my MobilComm alpha pager at its 1 (800) number. To which Pat responded: > [TELECOM Digest Editor's Note: You need to speak with Doug Reuben about > the service he and his associates offer. It has been discussed here in > the Digest in the past, but not too much recently. Perhaps in response, > Doug will send a general update about his service to us. I can't find > him on the mailing list right now or I would include his email address > here. PAT] Well, to answer Eric's question, yes, indeed, we offer exactly the service you seem to need, and in many cases (as is the case for existing MobilComm Nationwide customers) at a flat monthly rate. Give us a call, check out our (messy :) ) WWW site, or send us some e-mail for details. I'll gladly respond to personal e-mail with specific questions about the service. See address/contact info, below. As to not being too active on the Digest lately: This is certainly a regret of mine - regular readers may recall (somewhat long :) ) posts from me regarding cellular service around the country which I think I enjoyed posting more than most people enjoyed reading (and reading, and reading...:) ). And the volume hasn't dwindled because of a lack of subject matter nor a lessening of my interest - if anything, there are so many developments going on right now that I'd need to post a good deal more than I used to in order to keep up. For example, Cell One/NY (now "AT&T Wireless"...errr..yeah) has had a recent switch upgrade which prevents calls to 500 numbers from being placed with 0-500 anymore. AT&T has also stopped supervising 500 *platform* calls (ie, where you don't talk to anyone and just connect to the platform) which means I don't pay for the 500 call until I talk to someone. This makes people much more likely to call my 500 from a cellphone, since they don't pay if I don't answer my 500#. AT&T has promised to allow 1-500 dialing from carphones (did they REALLY think this through? Or will they only allow 1-500 from a class of "non-International" 500? Or can they do special non-fixed-rate billing through cellcos?...Doubt it..). However, this misses the point: Allow NON-superivising 0+ access for ALL calls, 500, 700, and calling card. No one wants to pay to reach a busy or non-answering number (except on LA's A and B systems, where they don't have a choice :( ), and AT&T puts its 500, 700, and Calling Card services at a disadvantage by continuing to supervise them at the AT&T "chime", instead of when the destination party is reached. Sprint, MCI, et. al. already do this, as do most of the "800" access calling cards, so why pay more to use AT&T, when you may not even connect to your party? Anyhow, as to what Interpage (TM) is doing, well, briefly, since we started a little over a year ago, we've gone "International" by sending e-mail, news, and other information to SMS and GSM phones in Europe (Vodaphone, Orange, SONOFON), as well as traditional alpha and numeric paging to BT, London Paging, Hutch (UK and Hong Kong), Cantel, and just about anyone else who asks. :) Although we have pretty low rates (25 cents per page to the UK), we would like to lower this even further. I realize we can never get "flat rate" (unlimited) paging like we do for some US carriers, but if there is any long distance carrier/reseller out there who can offer us less than 30-second minimums and/or "lower than the rest of the Wiltel reseller's" rates, I'd be happy to hear from you. (Please fax an International rate quote to our fax #, below. No voice calls please... E-Mail is OK, but include prices - we know more or less what is out there - if you think you are better, please have something to show for it. I'm not trying to be difficult, but we don't need a lot of resellers calling us with rates that are commonplace...) I'd also be glad to hear from carriers with less than 12 cent daytime rates for direct dial (no T-1, yet!). We have also started to provide our news and information services to a number of paging carriers, so if you see the news/sports/weather-cast on your pager saying "Interpage" or "InfoNews", well, that's us! :) Some carriers and other firms use us to disseminate their own news via a news "editor" on our system which they use to input their own information to their customers/employees on a regular or "as needed" basis. If you *do* receive "Interpage" or "InfoNews" stories, please let us know what you think, and of course, tell us how we can improve and/or augment these services. Are there any additional services would you like to see? For example, is there any interest in aviation weather forecasts on a pager? Horoscopes? We tried a few of these, but found little interest... We are also the only paging service provider (I think) to put weather and stock information on any *numeric only* pager, so you do not need to get a more expensive alpha pager in order to receive this information. We have not, however, figured out how to get news stories on a numeric yet...:) In June, we started to offer our Enhanced Pager Overlay Services (EPOS). Working with Arch and SDC, we can provide e-mail, weather, re-programmable 800 access, voicemail, "Meet Me", faxmail, and most recently, fax broadcast to literally hundreds of recipients via a single 800 number which you can access from anywhere in the US and most areas of Canada. This package builds upon our initial notion of allowing ANY alpha or numeric pager to receive e-mail and other services, but goes beyond this by providing one single number for people to contact you at for e-mail, voice, voicemail, fax and fax broadcast services. (Our Web site has a detailed explanation of this if you want more details on how EPOS works, etc.) We have also made some substantial additions to our fax services. Besides our InFax (SM) (automatic INcoming e-mail -> fax [and pager]) and OutFax (SM) (you send text e-mail or postcript level 1 or 2 to one or more faxes), we have recently started to offer our FaxUp (SM) service, which allows people to send a fax to us, and we will automatically convert it into a graphics file and send it along as e-mail to you. FaxUp can also be used to re-distribute and broadcast faxes: You send us a fax, and we re-transmit it to a list of fax and/or e-mail addresses which you may upload to the system, or configue/modify via telnet access to your personal account. InterTalk (SM), our e-mail voice response server has also been improved since my last post to the Digest - well, we didn't *have* InterTalk at the time of my last posting so I guess anything is an "improvement". InterTalk allows you to retrieve and hear e-mail subject headers from any touch tone phone. Thus, to check to see if you received any new e-mail messages, you would call into InterTalk, enter your account and password, and then have the option to go through the headers of all your most recent mail. We also recently added the ability to call into InterTalk and add or delete weather forecasts as you travel. If you travel from city to city a good deal, you can add a weather forecast for the city you happen to be in (or any city for that matter) and tell our system at what time you want to be paged. Subsequently, you will be paged with that city's forecast at your requested time. It makes a good "wake up" service which also gives you the day's weather, assuming you don't normally receive pages in the middle of the night! :) And finally, we consolidated a number of our services for WWW customers under the "WebReach" (SM) banner. Interpage's WebReach services allow WWW page owners on any system (not just ours) to be faxed when a customer browsing their web page sends and order or requests more information. This allows individuals and firms to have a WWW/Internet presence, without having to log on continuously to ensure timely response to potential customers. We can also store documents and informational sheets on our system which will be faxed to customers "on demand". If you have a pager, we can also create a "callback" service, eg., a customer clicks on a hot button on your page which will alert you on your pager that you have a potential customer who would like an immediate callback at the number provided. Additionally, direct mapping of WWW pages without the need for complicated URL's is something new which we recently implemented. Thus, if you have registered the domain "hello.com" and have your Web page on our system, you can give out your URL as "www.hello.com", instead of the actual URL which would look like "www.interpage.net/misc/others/hello.html". Anyhow, now that I've bored everyone with all of our newest and greatest services and features, I'll suggest that you may want to check out our WWW server (http://www.interpage.net) for more information. We'd also be happy to fax some literature and brochures to anyone who asks. So now do you see what I mean by LONG posts? :) Before I close, I would however like to thank all the people who have helped us along in the past, especially those Digest participants who encouraged us during our beta-test stage last year and enabled us to grow quite rapidly. Your comments, constructive criticsms, and of course your patronage have all been greatly appreciated! My next post will be much more telecom-related, and soon... I promise! :) Doug Reuben / Interpage(TM) Network Services Inc. dreuben@interpage.net +1 (203) 499 - 5221 (800) 624 - 6964 (EPOS) FAX(718) 793 - 6081 ------------------------------ Quick question: I'm a reporter with the {Anchorage Daily News} in Alaska. Our city government is proposing to sell our phone company, Anchorage Telephone Utility, which I gather is the largest municipally owned phone company in the country. I'm trying to find examples of other cities selling similarly sized phone companies. (ATU is about 145,000 access lines.) I want to see what happened in other places, vis. rates, layoffs, etc. Where can I find other examples? Any help gratefully received. ------------------------------ End of TELECOM Digest V15 #373 ******************************